I think I screwed up

wilburwb · Post by **wilburwb** » Sat Jan 04, 2014 03:20

Hi Igor, yes, I was thinking about 35% weight loss and i would cut into one of them. They are now hanging at about 58DegF with about 80% humidity. Thanks so much for your help.

Bill

Igor Duńczyk · Post by **Igor Duńczyk** » Wed Jan 15, 2014 00:48

Hi Bill

I´m SO curous to know how your perhaps-not-so-screwed-up First Generation Salami turned out after your last posting - mould growth or not

Igor Duńczyk · Post by **Igor Duńczyk** » Wed Jan 15, 2014 00:49

...c u r i o u s

wilburwb · Post by **wilburwb** » Wed Jan 15, 2014 01:11

Hello Igor, thanks for your interest. At this point all looks good. I weighed them again on Friday evening and they were down about 25-26%. I'm thinking I'll weigh them again this coming weekend and if they're down to 30% I will cut into one of them. What do you think? How will I know if they are safe? I'm thinking that if they don't smell rotten they should be OK. Any advise? As far as the mold goes, there is none.

I must have done something wrong when I mixed it. I added it to some distilled water and let it sit for 12 hours before topping it up with more distilled water then spraying on the clubs hanging in the chamber. Other than that I don't know what else could have gone wrong. Thanks again Igor. Hope to talk to you again soon,

Bill

Igor Duńczyk · Post by **Igor Duńczyk** » Thu Jan 16, 2014 20:34

Hello again Bill, I have asked my chief researcher at the starter culture producer with whom I´m a bit involved (not as brazenly as it might sound - just professionally involved

) about the absence-of-mould syndrome. From your describtion of the process she concluded that the mould should have had a good opportunity to grow. So we are a bit puzzled.

Also, dissolving the culture 12 hours before use should not be a must.
At least I would not wait that long.
Does the direction of use really call for this waiting phase??

Otherwise mould spores are sturdy and don´t pop off that easily UNLESS you have used casings that were surface treated with a mould-killer like Natamycin in order to prevent mould growth. Could that be the case?

wilburwb · Post by **wilburwb** » Fri Jan 17, 2014 02:26

Igor Duńczyk wrote:Hello again Bill, I have asked my chief researcher at the starter culture producer with whom I´m a bit involved (not as brazenly as it might sound - just professionally involved

Hello Igor, now that's funny!

What follows are instructions for use for a 25 gm package of Mold-600 Bactoferm: "One pouch of freeze-dried culture is mixed into 200 to 500 mL of tap water at approximately 20°C and equilibrated for 12 hours at room temperature. The suspension is diluted in 10 L of tap water and is then ready for use. The mold is inoculated after the stuffing and acclimatization process, either by dipping or spraying. The spore suspension should be stirred from time to time to prevent settling of the spores, and the suspension should only be used on the day of preparation".

I used about a quarter of the package and mixed that with about a cup of distilled water and let it set for 12 hours. I then diluted with more distilled water to a total of about 1 liter. I then sprayed the casings with the solution when they went into the dry cure chamber. Should I have sprayed them before they went into the fermenting chamber? Also, I am very confident that my casings were not surface treated with a mold killer.

I look forward to hearing from you again soon. Thanks again,

Bill

Igor Duńczyk · Post by **Igor Duńczyk** » Sat Jan 18, 2014 13:12

Bill, you seem to have done everything right so we are a bit puzzled over here...
Only advice is to try again perhaps with a new sachet of 600 from another production batch.
Usually it should work but if you would want to try the SACCO alternative then it´s called FPN-63 010 and the mold strain has great likelyness to the CH´600.

Post by **Bob K** » Sat Jan 18, 2014 17:53

Wilbur-

For small batches I don't bother to dilute as I only would be throwing out the leftover.
I do brush on , not spray, and have applied before and after fermenting with good results.

Not diluting has produced a more uniform mold coating. The times I diluted and sprayed produced blotchy results...but I guess still got the job done.

A couple of Coppa's (whoops one half gone) and some Genoa

wilburwb · Post by **wilburwb** » Sat Jan 18, 2014 18:10

Hello Igor, I will look into the Sacco brand mold culture. I weighed them again yesterday and they are down about 30%. I may slice into one today! I will report my findings. Thanks again so much for all your help. This forum is an incredible resource for valuable information thanks to you and others like you. Tak,

Bill

wilburwb · Post by **wilburwb** » Sat Jan 18, 2014 18:18

Hello Bob K, thanks for the pointers. May I ask: are you using Bactoferm-600? How much of the package do you use each time? How much distilled water? And do you mix and let it sit for a certain amount of time before brushing it on?
Btw, those look beautiful and delicious. Thanks again,

Bill

Post by **Bob K** » Sat Jan 18, 2014 18:35

Bill-

Yes I use the Bactoferm-600. I only use around 2 grams and mix with 1/4 cup water.

To be honest I have gotten the best results after letting sit for 24 hrs.

Thank You they are my first attempt at a larger diameter salami so I have my fingers crossed.

Igor Duńczyk · Post by **Igor Duńczyk** » Sat Jan 18, 2014 22:55

Bob K wrote:To be honest I have gotten the best results after letting sit for 24 hrs.

That´s interesting information Bob - thanks for sharing. Obviously it seems to work well - the coppa looks superb! How long did it hang by now?

wilburwb · Post by **wilburwb** » Sat Jan 18, 2014 23:07

Well I can't figure out how to post a photo or I would but I sliced into one of the salami sticks today and I'm rather pleased that I'm not ill yet!

I'm very happy with the way things turned out. They've lost about 30% and i think i will let the other sticks go for another week or so to firm up even more. A question about storage: do they keep well frozen if they are vacuum sealed? I would like to take one down to my dad in North Carolina when i visit but that won't be till April. Thanks again everyone,

Bill

Post by **Bob K** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 00:12

Igor Duńczyk wrote:That´s interesting information Bob - thanks for sharing. Obviously it seems to work well - the coppa looks superb! How long did it hang by now?

The one that I am using now went in 10/15 the second started 11/28 and I am going to try and let it go 120 days before cutting.

I used Redzed's (Chris) recipe http://wedlinydomowe.pl/en/viewtopic.ph ... c&start=30
It has a wonderfully complex taste that seems to grow with age.

Igor Duńczyk · Post by **Igor Duńczyk** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 02:05

GREAT CONGRATS´Bill on your successfull first entry into the world of fermented sausages (waving-Stars-and-stripes emoticon). Personally I would regard saving salamis in the freezer as the last resort as structure may suffer. However even if vacuum should provide some protection against overtly drying out 3½ months is somewhat of a challenge if unfrozen. Vacuum though should provide protection against overtly drying out.

Also there is the unknown factor of the starter culture F-RM-52 which you used.
Because it is a fast culture it doesn´t allow for the same prolonged staphyloccocus activity that you´ll have when using (for instance) the slower T-SPX. One of the drawbacks of the shorter staph activity being that it also allows less time for the enzymatic reactions which a. o. helps to prevent rancidity in the fat tissue.

However you were lucky enough to (by sheer mishap

) to add a very low amount of dextrose which may have helped to keep the foot from the speeder of the F-RM-52 hence allowing a little longer time for the staphyloccocus to romp around before they were laid to rest... So perhaps rancidity won´t become an issue after all. I sure hope so!
But why not embark on a couple of just as successfull followups before you go visiting the Ol´folks?

I would consider the Chris/Redzet recipe that Bob has used with exceedingly good results...