Patty forming equipment

Thewitt · Post by **Thewitt** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 09:20

Does anyone have experience with patty forming equipment?

We've been making "seasoned pork patties" for a customer by hand for about a month, using an Italian sausage recipe.

The volume has increased to the point where it's time to automate.

I need to be able to control the size. These patties are for "slider" sized burgers, and need to be a uniform thickness as well. Current patties are 9cm x 2cm before cooking, with about 20% shrinkage.

We only need to do about 1000 a day, so manually operated equipment is fine, though I would expect to be able to make 1 patty every 5 seconds.

Suggestions?

resistbody · Post by **resistbody** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 00:08

I have no exp. but still interased to automate (not at this point).
First, what is your stuffer(if you have some) hudraulic, manual or....
For paties best is drum-type machine, as 1000pcs are not so much(more than mines, so I'm still at manual forming) you should look for semi automatic machine.
This is one type of forming device http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FL10ul42lzc and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-fBwzRelQk you could DIY easly, or buy it.
This seems to be better type http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uzXmjc577w
This is best semy-automatic patty forming attachment https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7PDzK3t7lY#t=16 http://www.superiorfoodmachinery.com/pr ... iller-p133

sawhorseray · Post by **sawhorseray** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 05:11

This works really well for me but I just do what I need at my own pace. Cabelas makes a doubles model that would lead to speedier production. You can make any sized patty once it's all set, I can pop out two a minute if I'm in a rush. Oh that's right, I'm never in a rush! I once stated that if your hobby becomes a business, deadlines and production can lead to a kind of stress where your hobby isn't as much fun anymore.

Here's the double model, if nothing else there's at least uniformity

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Cabelas- ... l+Products

It's cheap, productive, and accurate. If labor is cheap, which I assume it is, this might pay off. Geez, I'm glad to not be in a rush to do anything anymore. Life is good! RAY

Thewitt · Post by **Thewitt** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 08:59

Thanks guys.

I had not considered hanging something off one of my stuffers, but I have a Frey and might be able to just buy an attachment - though I need a smaller size.

Post by **Bob K** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 13:37

Thewitt-

I have the one that attaches to your stuffer. It works very well and is quick and easy to use.

However the patties are between 1/3 and 1/2 lb and it is not adjustable for size.

ssorllih · Post by **ssorllih** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 18:34

I use a section of plastic pipe and a portion scoop and the papers. Several rings and two people would be pretty fast.

sawhorseray · Post by **sawhorseray** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 19:35

Bob K wrote:Thewitt-

I have the one that attaches to your stuffer. It works very well and is quick and easy to use.

However the patties are between 1/3 and 1/2 lb and it is not adjustable for size.

I got the same thing a couple years back from Cabelas, the white plastic attachment that goes on the front of the grinder. I remember the patties weighing .38lb each and making quite a mess. I didn't like the fact I couldn't make bigger burgers so that wasted $60 sits on a shelf in the pantry, never to be used again. RAY

Post by **Bob K** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 19:53

Ray

I did the same thing used on my 1HP grinder a it did not work well. In fact it sucked! and I put it away for a few years Then I got a 15lb stuffer...

If you use a stuffer its a different story.

patties average around 7oz.

I also have the adjustable 1 and 2 Pattie jobs like you have...but I do my Venison burgers and sausage patties in 50 lb batches and it saves a lot of time.

unclebuck · Post by **unclebuck** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 22:21

I also bought the pattie maker that fits on the grinder from Cabela's and found the patties to be somewhat bigger that what we wanted. I took the unit to a friend's machine shop where he built me the patty forming insert(from inert and food safe material) with a smaller diameter and thickness. I use it on my water powered sausage press to do the job. It now does the sizes that we want. Simple solution.

sawhorseray · Post by **sawhorseray** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 22:45

Bob K wrote:Ray- I also have the adjustable 1 and 2 Pattie jobs like you have...but I do my Venison burgers and sausage patties in 50 lb batches and it saves a lot of time.

Yeah, fifty pounds is a real load and a lot of work. I almost never make a load of anything more than 22lbs because that's what comfortably fits in my meat mixer, my 20lb vertical stuffer always requires a final wrap-up load anyway from spillage and busted casings. I like my hipshot burgers right at the recommended 8oz, breakfast sausage right at 6oz. Oh, my wife wants me to make her a burger right now! RAY

Thewitt · Post by **Thewitt** » Sat Feb 08, 2014 05:59

ssorllih wrote:I use a section of plastic pipe and a portion scoop and the papers. Several rings and two people would be pretty fast.

It doesn't appear I can purchase food grade PVC locally in Malaysia, so I'll have to find a source to do this.

sawhorseray · Post by **sawhorseray** » Sat Feb 08, 2014 11:59

3 & 4 inch PVC is most commonly used as waste pipe, going to be hard to find as "food grade" anywhere. Give this site a try, they seem to be global and are connected everywhere in your part of the world. You could also think of going with welded or carbon steel pipe, stainless steel in the size you'll be needing will also be hard to find. Good luck. RAY

http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb ... e+pvc+pipe

Thewitt · Post by **Thewitt** » Sat Feb 08, 2014 12:03

Most of the suppliers on Alibaba simply represent Chinese companies and are not really stocking dealers.... It's a huge pain to use. Occasionally I find something useful in their lists, but generally not.

ssorllih · Post by **ssorllih** » Sat Feb 08, 2014 15:12

A local machine shop could produce aluminum rings is exactly the sizes needed or they could be turned from wood.

el Ducko · Post by **el Ducko** » Mon Feb 10, 2014 17:42

sawhorseray wrote:3 & 4 inch PVC is most commonly used as waste pipe, going to be hard to find as "food grade" anywhere.

True, Ray, the big stuff is most commonly used as waste pipe, but the smaller stuff is used for water supply pipe, so I wouldn't shy away from PVC. Just don't use "used" PVC. (Sewage! Yuck!)

I looked around on the internet, and found the following 5-year article which may be of general interest.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090606150900AAKF1eh wrote:...it should be noted that a plastic container can no longer be considered food grade if it has been used to store non-food items like chemicals, paint, or detergent.

That same article gives a good summary of the different types of plastic. A portion of it reads:

Types Of Plastic

In the United States, the following codes represent the seven categories of plastic used in nearly all plastic containers and product packaging:

<1>PET or PETE (polyethylene terephthalate) is a clear, tough polymer with exceptional gas and moisture barrier properties. PET's ability to contain carbon dioxide (carbonation) makes it ideal for use in soft drink bottles. Examples: Soft drink bottles, detergent bottles

<2>HDPE (high density polyethylene) is used in milk, juice and water containers in order to take advantage of its excellent protective barrier properties. Its chemical resistance properties also make it well suited for items such as containers for household chemicals and detergents. Most five gallon food buckets are made from HDPE. Examples: Milk bottles, shopping bags

<3>Vinyl (polyvinyl chloride, or PVC) provides excellent clarity, puncture resistance and cling. As a film, vinyl can breathe just the right amount, making it ideal for packaging fresh meats that require oxygen to ensure a bright red surface while maintaining an acceptable shelf life. Examples: Plastic food wrap, shrink wrap, garden hoses, shoe soles

<4>LDPE (low density polyethylene) offers clarity and flexibility. It is used to make bottles that require flexibility. To take advantage of its strength and toughness in film form, it is used to produce grocery bags and garbage bags, shrink and stretch film, and coating for milk cartons. Examples: Squeeze bottles, dry cleaning bags

<5>PP (polypropylene) has high tensile strength, making it ideal for use in caps and lids that have to hold tightly on to threaded openings. Because of its high melting point, polypropylene can be hot-filled with products designed to cool in bottles, including ketchup and syrup. It is also used for products that need to be incubated, such as yogurt. Many Cambo, Tupperware and Rubbermaid food storage containers are made from PP. Examples: Bottle caps, take-out food containers, drinking straws

<6>PS (polystyrene), in its crystalline form, is a colorless plastic that can be clear and hard. It can also be foamed to provide exceptional insulation properties. Foamed or expanded polystyrene (EPS) is used for products such as meat trays, egg cartons and coffee cups. It is also used for packaging and protecting appliances, electronics and other sensitive products. Examples: Plastic foam, packing peanuts, coat hangers

<7> Other denotes plastics made from other types of resin or from several resins mixed together. These usually cannot be recycled.

Another important type of plastic is polycarbonate, a clear shatter-resistant material used in restaurant food storage containers and recently in the Rubbermaid Stain Shield line of home food storage containers.

Let me conclude with a few of my own comments. (I was a chemical engineer, and worked around R&D and production facilities for polystyrene, polyethylene, polyethylene terephthalate, polyacrylonitrile, vinyl acetate, cellulose acetate, and several other polymers for 43 years.):
(1) Bear in mind that the contact between your patties and the patty-making equipment is on the order of seconds, so plasticizer migration will be practically nil. Storage in plastic containers would obviously be much more of a concern.
(2) Polycarbonate is the plastic which has been much maligned lately as containing a monomer, bis phenol A, commonly called BPA in the press. It is present in miniscule amounts, but miniscule may be too much in some people's opinion, so avoid it if you are a stickler for purity.
(3) Polyacrylonitrile is used in clear meat packing trays. It was, early on, a contender for the carbonated drink bottle market now supplied almost exclusively by polyethylene terephthalate, PET. However, in a bitter battle back in the mid 1970s, major PET producer DuPont successfully lobbied to keep Monsanto's poly-acrylonitrile business out of the soft drink bottle market.
(4) Just about every polymer has a plasticizer in it. A plasticizer is a compound which looks structurally similar to the polymer so therefore dissolves easily in it, and is used in making the polymer more pliable or causing it to flow more easily during machining or molding operations. They've gone away from nearly all of the nasty ones (benzene and methylene chloride used to be great, but are carcinogens). Some are volatile; some are not. (..."new car smell," anyone?)
(5) There are lots of specialty polymers used in medical appliances and food applications (such as can liners), from nylon up to really exotic stuff. All sorts of monomers and plasticizers are out there. Interestingly, sometimes you have to prove that something is BAD before its use is prohibited, rather than the more rational approach of proving that it is NOT bad before allowing its use. ...and then, there's the food industry, which... uh...

Go figure. Genetically-modified organisms, anyone? (Just try AVOIDING 'em in the US. Good luck.)