Beef Sticks

Rich
User
User
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 03:56
Location: Louisiana

Post by Rich » Tue Dec 29, 2015 07:05

Thanks again for all the advice from multiple sources...feel like a rookie cop on day two of academy again ! :lol: I'm learning fellas ( and ladies ) please, bear with me ! :shock: . Gotta post at weird hours due to evening shift patrol schedule, sorry 'bout delayed responses.

Cheers,

Rich
User avatar
Bob K
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 2107
Joined: Sun Jun 02, 2013 15:16
Location: Northwest Ct

Post by Bob K » Tue Dec 29, 2015 14:33

Rich wrote:another question, can I substitute venison for beef and expect similar results providing the %of fat is the same ?
That's a definite yes. :mrgreen:
Rich wrote:and look at buying a PH meter, any recommendations ? Preferably somewhere south of US $ 100.00 !
There are many available, its real nice to have one with the replaceable/detachable electrodes with BNC connection.

The Sausage Maker sells this one: http://www.sausagemaker.com/Milwaukee-p ... 1-1523.htm

You can upgrade to the meat probe at a later date (it costs more than the meter)

I have the 102 model with auto calibration and a temp probe...makes life easier

http://www.testequipmentdepot.com/milwa ... /mw102.htm
Rich
User
User
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 03:56
Location: Louisiana

Post by Rich » Wed Dec 30, 2015 07:34

Bob, thank you, that is probably the unit I'll buy ! And, that's a good thing on the venison as I have an almost unlimited supply...legally, we can harvest six here, four in a sister state where I also hunt...makes for a good supply of venison...we also trap wild hogs...again, just about an unlimited supply...as I recently found out ya have to treat wild hog in a similar fashion to venison, it's rather lean...made some Italian fresh sausage...did not add fat, the result was, um, less than stellar...still learning !!!
:lol: :cool:
Rich
User
User
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 03:56
Location: Louisiana

Post by Rich » Sun Jan 17, 2016 05:57

Feeling totally frustrated ! No matter what I do I cannot seem to get to get my beef sticks to get to the same look as yours ! 2.5 hours cold smoke (55 F), 3hrs @ 100 F, 2 hrs @125 F, 2 hrs @ 140 F, 155 until internal was 152 F, they still do not look like yours Butterbean...have no idea what I'm doing wrong...I am trying to use up my "premix" seasonings so I did not do your exact recipe (spices and such). Oh well, they taste good according to the natives, I'll get there eventually ! Also trying to figure out how to post pics...again, will get there eventually !

Cheers,

Rich
Last edited by Rich on Sun Jan 17, 2016 14:42, edited 2 times in total.
Rich
User
User
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 03:56
Location: Louisiana

Post by Rich » Sun Jan 17, 2016 06:46

BTW, I lengthened the smoke times due to the fact I used 17 mm collagen case as opposed to 15 mm...wonder if that is the problem ? A. Can't stuff 15 mm, b. Like a bit "beefier" stick...all advice and suggestions most welcome ! :)

Cheers,

Rich
User avatar
Bob K
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 2107
Joined: Sun Jun 02, 2013 15:16
Location: Northwest Ct

Post by Bob K » Sun Jan 17, 2016 14:48

I know you are using a spice mix but does it contain Soy Protein? If not, you could try adding some in the amount of Butterbeans original recipe.
Butterbean wrote:Another thing worth noting is the soy protein concentrate makes a world of difference in the ability to stuff these small casings and the end texture and mouth feel of the stick. I've made the same without the SPC and they seemed drier and more crumbly. This one is dead on as far as mouth feel.
Rich
User
User
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 03:56
Location: Louisiana

Post by Rich » Sun Jan 17, 2016 18:42

It does contain soy protein.

Some got to the texture I wanted, most got partially there.

I believe the problem is associated with the smoker. The better sticks were over or near the heating element, I think the Masterbuilt smoker has a problem in that the vent is directly over the heating element. I suspect the heat, smoke, and moisture go straight up and really doesn't circulate well.

Cheers,

Rich
User avatar
redzed
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 3385
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2012 06:29
Location: Vancouver Island

Post by redzed » Sun Jan 17, 2016 22:56

Rich wrote: I believe the problem is associated with the smoker. The better sticks were over or near the heating element, I think the Masterbuilt smoker has a problem in that the vent is directly over the heating element. I suspect the heat, smoke, and moisture go straight up and really doesn't circulate well.
Lots of guys have found that their sticks come out better when they are smoked on racks rather than hung. And very few smokers will smoke and heat evenly. That is why we always need to rotate and move the sausages while smoking. And based on numerous posts, Masterbuilt owners do all kinds of modifications to better distribute the heat and smoke.

And to me, over 10 hours of smoke may be overdoing it a bit. Maybe Butterbean could comment on that.
Rich
User
User
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 03:56
Location: Louisiana

Post by Rich » Mon Jan 18, 2016 17:11

Thanks Redzed, guess I'll try the horizontal position and rotate the racks ! Any suggestions for mods to distribute heat and smoke ?

Cheers,

Rich
User avatar
Butterbean
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1861
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 04:10
Location: South Georgia

Post by Butterbean » Sat Apr 02, 2016 23:54

I wanted to revisit this thread to say I think I am now 95% certain our thoughts on why meat sometimes doesn't adhere to a small collagen casing is due to both the lack of using a binder and/or not stuffing it tight enough when a binder is not used.

I say this because I just made a batch of these and I forgot to use a binder.(Brain flatulence) Anyhow, recognizing my ommission, albeit too late, I made a conscious effort to stuff the casings as tight as possible. So tight they would run horizontal to the table a foot before bending. This created a few blowouts but I felt it necessary to do this to insure the mince bound to the casing. I noticed if you pay close attention to the casing you'll see some striations between the ring things in the casing - there needs to be enough pressure on the casing to make these disappear and become totally smooth.

Thinking of our discussion on this I decided to back off on the pressure and run about four foot of casings at less pressure just as a test.

When I finished and began packaging the meat I was hit by an epiphany because there clear as day was about four foot of snack sticks that had those dreaded voids in it where the mince didn't stick. This totaled to 1% of the total length run so it was more than coincidence.

So my conclusion is this:

You don't have to use a binder but you do have to stuff these small casings very tight to insure the bond.

Using a binder will make stuffing easier and will reduce the water loss which I am now almost certain is why these voids are formed. I'm all but certain the collagen casing simply lacks the elasticity that a natural casing and can only shrink a set amount which isn't much at all.

Sound reasonable?
User avatar
redzed
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 3385
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2012 06:29
Location: Vancouver Island

Post by redzed » Mon Apr 04, 2016 17:27

Probably a plausible explanation, but there may be other factors. I think it still may have to do something with the different types of collagen casings. I have found that the mahogany coloured casings shrink better and adhere to the sticks than the white ones. And they don't do well when it's humid, so you have to make sure that you smoke with dry smoke. But some sort of binder no doubt makes a difference. My dad who has been making sausage for 70 years taught me a long time ago that too much milk powder makes natural casings adhere too much to the sausage, making them hard to peel. And when we make snack sticks we want that effect. :lol:
User avatar
Butterbean
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1861
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 04:10
Location: South Georgia

Post by Butterbean » Mon Apr 04, 2016 19:44

Well I did say 95% certain. :lol: :lol:

I was using the mahogany casings and while I think you can make them without a binder the trouble you have stuffing them tight enough to insure a good bond isn't worth the hassle so from now on I'll always be using a binder as long as I'm not impeded by another bout of brain flatulence. :oops:
Post Reply