Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

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LOUSANTELLO
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Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

Post by LOUSANTELLO » Sun May 24, 2020 11:53

This is now my 2nd batch of ground pork 40mm casings, using cure #2 along with 2.5% salt and 0.3% dextrose. Original PH of pork was anywhere from 5.61-5.7. I am now at 60 hours at 70F, 88% humidity with little to no PH drop. In fact, one batch I'm getting readings 0.5 higher than the original occasionally. What seems to be going on here? There also has to be some rule of thumb to how much dextrose is needed to drop the PH to the desired level based on it's starting point,,,,but in this case, they aren't even moving. I really don't want to take these to 120 hours.
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redzed
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Re: Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

Post by redzed » Wed May 27, 2020 03:03

Give us more info on the type of meat you used, the grind and spices. Source and freshness of the meat. Starting pH of 5.61 is on the lower end, possibly a younger animal. And are you sure you added the sugar? I know it's a dumb question, but last month I brined some bacon and beef tongues and forgot the cure. :oops:
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Re: Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

Post by LOUSANTELLO » Wed May 27, 2020 04:12

Pork Loin, no additional fat. It was about 12-15% fat, fine grind. Typical for me 2.5% sea salt, 0.25% cure #2, 0.3% cayenne, 0.3% ground red pepper flakes and I added 0.3% smoked paprika. I added 0.35% dextrose. The loin was processed on 5-11-20 and I ground the meat on the 21st. 1.6"x12' air dried hog casings, hung at 70-71F. The humidity reached 88%. Monitoring the PH, it fluctuated anywhere from 5.56-5.65,,,yes, it even creeped up. After 84 hours and not seeing it go anywhere, I transferred it to 47F, 75RH. I still have the cup of mix that I was measuring. Even today (24 hours after transfer), the PH is not moving, although they are getting red and have that fermented smell. They smell awesome.
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Re: Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

Post by cajuneric » Fri Jun 05, 2020 18:13

How did your salami turn out? Did you get the ph drop or did you toss it?

I've been experimenting with different ingredients that I can add to my mince to introduce LAB's. Things like fresh garlic, sauerkraut juice, kombucha, kefir, buttermilk, yoghurt, kvass, things like that. So far the results have been incredibly promising.
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redzed
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Re: Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

Post by redzed » Sat Jun 13, 2020 17:18

Lou, with the .35% dextrose and additional sugar in the paprika, you should have had a pH drop. What happened will probably remain a mystery. I probably had something to do with the meat, but I can't speculate further. I'll bet if you repeat the process and utilize meat from a different source you will get a pH drop.
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Re: Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

Post by redzed » Sat Jun 13, 2020 17:40

cajuneric wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 18:13
I've been experimenting with different ingredients that I can add to my mince to introduce LAB's. Things like fresh garlic, sauerkraut juice, kombucha, kefir, buttermilk, yoghurt, kvass, things like that. So far the results have been incredibly promising.
Achieving fermentation in meat is indeed incredibly easy. If done properly, just adding some carbohydrate will re-awaken the LAB already present in the meat. When I experimented with fermenting with yogourt and probiotic supplements, I was able to get a fast fermentation every time. However, controlling the speed of the fermentation was a problem. In products that require a longer drying maturation period, a fast pH drop is detrimental to nitrate reduction and the activity and longevity of the gram-positive bacteria. The latter are just as important in salami making as the fermentation process. Some experts claim that the Staphylococcus bacteria is more important that LAb in the ripening process.
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Re: Difficulty with non-culture PH drop

Post by cajuneric » Sat Jun 13, 2020 17:45

I completely agree. I am noticing the same thing...
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