Project KB (For Beginners)

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el Ducko
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Post by el Ducko » Sun Aug 17, 2014 18:02

Bob K wrote:...Better off staying on the high side of the allowed limit to be on the safe side...
Um... high side of the recommended range, but below (rather than on the high side of) the recommended limit. ...which is what I think you meant. (Sometimes, the English gets in the way.)
:mrgreen:
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Post by Bob K » Sun Aug 17, 2014 18:09

el Ducko wrote:
Bob K wrote:...Better off staying on the high side of the allowed limit to be on the safe side...
Um... high side of the recommended range, but below (rather than on the high side of) the recommended limit. ...which is what I think you meant. (Sometimes, the English gets in the way.)
:mrgreen:

Yes below...not over

Cw do they still allow Lead shot for waterfowl? :idea:
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Post by el Ducko » Sun Aug 17, 2014 18:12

grasshopper wrote:My question is how long will, Cured, Cooked, And Smoked Sausage last in the fridge. Freeze and thaw does change the texture and some taste. I would like to keep the original as long as I can. Or what is the best way.
Most recipes recommend 3 days or less in the refrigerator, 3 months or less in the freezer, unless it's a cured/dried sausage and is stable without refrigeration.

I vacuum pack, then freeze, my cured/cooked/smoked sausages. If you vacuum pack or wrap well, you can probably extend the frozen "life" a bit.

However, in our household, Beloved Spouse makes me use it or throw it out. That way, she has room for all the sticks, leaves, berries, gravel, and yard clippings that she uses to make her granola recipe.
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Post by Shuswap » Mon Aug 18, 2014 00:07

el Ducko wrote:However, in our household, Beloved Spouse makes me use it or throw it out. That way, she has room for all the sticks, leaves, berries, gravel, and yard clippings that she uses to make her granola recipe.
Geeeeese Russ, what happened to your Texas swagger (must be in North Carolina) acknowledging before all your WD friends that Betsy is in charge. :lol:
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Post by grasshopper » Mon Aug 18, 2014 00:19

A good woman knows how to make man think he is in charge. I really don't know how they do that. But who cares!
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Post by grasshopper » Mon Aug 18, 2014 00:34

I really want to thank CW for all the work that he has put into this project and the forum.It surly takes a lot of time. I think he dose this so he can get after El Ducko, which I think he enjoys. Again thank you for your effort. Attaboy
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Post by sambal badjak » Mon Aug 18, 2014 07:58

Lots of interesting info here!
Thanks all.

Just quickly getting back to the milk powder:
I see the options and substitutions possible between the soy protein and low fat milk powder.
But since I can't get either: Can I use full fat milk powder?
Or maybe any other substitute (egg white or ...)?
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Post by graybeard » Mon Aug 18, 2014 13:47

The burgers were great we really enjoyed them.
Here is 6 oz ready to go on to the patty press
Image
after the patty press
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getting them ready to take off the grill
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We will be making these again.
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Post by el Ducko » Mon Aug 18, 2014 15:58

Shuswap wrote:Geeeeese Russ, what happened to your Texas swagger (must be in North Carolina) acknowledging before all your WD friends that Betsy is in charge. :lol:
Grasshopper wrote:I really want to thank CW for all the work that he has put into this project and the forum.It surely takes a lot of time. I think he does this so he can get after El Ducko, which I think he enjoys. Again thank you for your effort. Attaboy
UhOh! I sense a conspiracy building.
Hmmmm.... What to do...? What to do...?
Image
AHAH! I know just the ticket. Hold that pose, Bubbie- - be right back.
(...rummages in freezer for rock-hard frozen sausage...)
(...gets distracted by the smell of delicious HipShot burgers on the grill...)
(...also known in Canada as SlapShot burgers, eh???)
(...falls in...)
(Fortunately it's an upright freezer.)

:mrgreen:
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Post by Chuckwagon » Mon Aug 18, 2014 21:21

El DuckO.... Have you been chewing on peyote again? Snortin' sodium nitrate? :roll: No conspiracy... however, I`ve got a special saddle made just for you. Yup, your own hand-made saddle made just for galloping. It`s upholstered with porcupine hide! :shock:

Dang Rabid Duck! Image OOOOOOooooo!
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by Chuckwagon » Mon Aug 18, 2014 21:33

Shuswap, don`t short yourself. That sausage looks great. By the time you make it again, you will have learned 101 more improvements. By hand chopping the meat, I believe you may learn about the protein development in the primary bind... and just how important it is. Many folks like to grind the fat (frozen) and the meat separately in their sausages. Many people like to weigh each and add 20-25% fat to 75% lean, using two separate plates. A lot of folks like larger chunkies of fat... some like it smaller than the lean. It`s becomes a matter of personal taste. I like to put the meat through a 3/8" plate and the fat through a 1/4" plate. You`ll soon develop your own favorites.
You asked:
CW reading this thread I'm wondering if you use the dextrose, soy protein and milk in any fresh sausage that will be in patties.
Not so much dextrose in fresh sausage as it is mostly reserved for the air-dried type sausage as a nutrient for pediococcus bacteria. The soy-protein keeps a fresh-type patty from shrinking and from losing it`s moisture and I always add a little. However, there`s a limit as too much will keep the meat from "browning" as it is cooked. It fries up in a skillet with a reddish glaze on it. If this doesn`t bother you, go ahead and use it. It sure keeps the sausage from shrinking. Milk? Some folks use a little in their recipes. I can`t because I`m allergic to it. It improves the consistency of the meat if you don`t get carried away with it. For instance, it is used in my Hipshot Burgers and people really like it.

BobK, you are mighty welcome sir. Glad to have you with us. There is much more information coming up about nitrates and nitrites.
You aksed:
Cw do they still allow Lead shot for waterfowl?
They do where I live but I`m developing a guided missile-type, exploding ammo just for ducks... certain ducks that is... the breed known as the Texas Painint`arse Anatidae.

Grasshopper, you asked:
My question is how long will, Cured, Cooked, And Smoked Sausage last in the fridge. Freeze and thaw does change the texture and some taste. I would like to keep the original as long as I can. Or what is the best way.
Mike, we haven`t quite gotten to that type of sausage yet, but I`ll answer it here. Because the Cured, Cooked, And Smoked sausage has been "cured" with an actual nitrite substance, and especially because it has been "prep" cooked, it is much safer than "fresh-type" sausage to store a few days longer in your refrigerator. Here's the reason why:
Raw meat is tough because each bundle of muscle fibers is surrounded by a tough sheet of connective tissue - the same tissue that makes gelatin when boiled. When meat is cooked, the tough connective tissue denatures, and becomes soft gelatin. The proteins in the muscle fibers also denature. Enzymes in the tissue no longer function when they are denatured, so cooked meat will keep longer than raw meat.

If the meat is overcooked, the water in the fiber bundles boils, the gelatin bursts, and the meat dries out. At high temperatures, the proteins undergo further denaturing and "cross linking", making the meat tough again. Crisp bacon is an example of this. A thick juicy steak would be inedible if cooked to the hardness of bacon.
However, you must remember that this is still a perishable product and should be used up within a week or frozen. Freezing seems to keep it fairly satisfactorily if the moisture is removed from the vacuum package. There are time limits here... and about 3 months frozen in a vac-bag is about the limit. Just make some more!
Mike, you also wrote:
I really want to thank CW for all the work that he has put into this project and the forum.It surly takes a lot of time. I think he dose this so he can get after El Ducko, which I think he enjoys. Again thank you for your effort. Attaboy
Ol` pal... I really needed that "attaboy"! That`s my pay. Thank you sir... you are a gentleman and a scholar!

El Duckaroo... you wrote:
That way, she has room for all the sticks, leaves, berries, gravel, and yard clippings that she uses to make her granola recipe.
Does your sweet wife know you talk that-a-way? You, you..... you bughouse, barmy, cracked-up cuckoo! :roll:

Sambal Badjak asked:
Can I use full fat milk powder?
It sounds like you don`t have a choice. Why not keep trying to locate NFDM in the mean time? Also, it might help to "pulverize" your milk powder in a blender. Try to get the consistency of cornstarch.

Graybeard, your photos are terrific! The Hipshot Burgers look good enough to eat! How did you find the texture? Were they juicy? Nice goin' pal. :wink:

Keep the questions and comments coming folks. That's how we learn. I don't know all the answers, but I sure can make a helluva good sourdough, Dutchoven biscuit! :mrgreen:
I'f I don't know an answer to your question, I'll find it!

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon
Last edited by Chuckwagon on Tue Aug 19, 2014 18:05, edited 2 times in total.
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by Chuckwagon » Mon Aug 18, 2014 23:43

Everyone seems to be doing well with the project. We've had some good response and a lot of you have been amazed at how the protein development affects your final product. Before we leave that particular study, we'll explore how salt affects pork and beef. Without the effects of salt on the meat proteins in pork, we wouldn't have "ham".
Right now, lets have a look at the two next subjects in Stan's sausagemaking guide. Would you please click on these links and study the material? You're on fire sausage makers! Keep up the good work. :wink:

Grinding: http://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage ... nding-meat
Mixing: http://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage ... ixing-meat

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon
Last edited by Chuckwagon on Tue Aug 19, 2014 05:01, edited 2 times in total.
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by Chuckwagon » Tue Aug 19, 2014 04:55

What Is Meat And Why Does Salt Change Pork Into Ham?

Amino Acids And Proteins

Have you ever wondered what meat is made of? To begin with, it`s about 75% water. Another 20% is made of biological molecules called proteins. And just what is a protein? Without being overly complicated in a sausage forum, let`s just say that when organic compounds made from "amines" and "carboxylic acid" are put together, "chains" of something called "amino acids" are formed and their sequence dictates how proteins are shaped into a three-dimensional structure. This "nucleotide sequence" of their genes results in "folding" and determines its activity. And what activity! These little guys called proteins, have a herculean task to perform. They catalyze metabolic reactions, replicate DNA, respond to stimuli, and transport molecules from one location to another.

Let`s go back to amino acids for just a moment. The key elements of an amino acid are carbon, hydrogen, oxygen, and nitrogen and there are only about 500 known "classifications" or groups called alpha, beta, gamma, or delta. Amino acid "chains" in the form of proteins, comprise the second largest component (after water) of human muscles, cells and other tissues. These are the basic molecules of living tissue; the building blocks of life - whether it`s in the deer you shoot, the cow you carve into steaks, or the hog you grind into sausage. Indeed, in the proteins of all mammals, amino acids perform critical roles in life processes such as neurotransmitter transport and biosynthesis.

Okay, that only adds up to about 95% you may say. Well, we still must account for fat, glycogen (glucose sugar) and vitamins and minerals. Varying greatly from animal to animal, the fat content is somewhere around 3%. The other components listed account for only about 1% each.
Now, we said meat is about 3/4 water. Does this pertain to fat also? No, fat contains only about ten to fifteen percent water. This explains why a mature cow, having more fat, has proportionally less water.

Change In Protein Structure At Morbidity

When I was young and crazy (instead of old and foolish), I took careful aim at a rack of antlers wearing a deer, and released the arrow. What a trophy! I could hardly wait to sink my teeth into a fresh deer steak. By the time I had field dressed the animal, cleaned up a little, and packed the deer out of the deep canyon I was in, several hours had gone by and I was hungry. I had dried food in my fanny pack but I wanted some real venison for dinner! My ol` Daddy had warned me many times about eating a freshly killed animal in the stages of post mortem rigor, but I was on my own this year and I wanted meat for an evening meal! I had heard all the jokes about rigor mortis and frankly, I just didn`t give the matter much thought. So, having packed that animal halfway out of Timber Canyon, I build a campfire and re-sharpened my 6" Randall. After a few coals had burned down to glowing embers, I laid a steak on them and sprinkled it with a little salt. Oh my goodness, that steak smelled good! It was marvelous. I must have had a smile stuck to my face like a burro grinnin` in a cactus patch... all the way out of the canyon... Uhh, that is right up until about the time I arrived at the ranch, quickening my step, and making a beeline for the porcelin "comfort convenience"! Now, I`m not going to bother you with the "details" other than to mention I spent the best part of the next three days "reminiscing" whilst on that porcelain privy! I had learned one of life`s lessons the hard way. Man was not meant to consume flesh while it is yet in the state of rigor mortis.

In humans, following death, rigor mortis commences after about three hours, reaches maximum stiffness during the subsequent 12 hours, and gradually dissipates until approximately 48 to 60 hours after death. On the other hand, in the species Cervidae (deer), chemical changes occur as the heart stops, the flow of blood ceases, oxygen is no longer carried to the muscles, and the meat begins to stiffen as rigor mortis sets in. Its duration differs in various animals but in deer, the onset of rigor may require considerably more time - up to 24 hours - and its duration may be up to two weeks. During this "aging" period of time, the carcass is usually hung at a low temperature and a nice protective coating of flaky, white, penicillium nalgiovense mold (one of many genera of ascomyetous fungi), is most welcome. Deer hunters should note that the temperature of the meat before rigor mortis sets in should not drop below about 50° F., or the meat will become tough when later cooked. However, upon the onset of rigor and during the aging process, the carcass should be cooled and kept within the range of 30° - 40° F. It is important to note that during this "aging" period of rigor mortis, the meat should not be processed and consumed. Leave the stuff alone and go play golf until the meat surpasses the rigor mortis stage.

It is interesting to note that in her splendid wisdom, Mother Nature has allowed us a "quick processing" time period immediately following an animal`s death. If the preparation is done without delay following slaughter, the meat may be processed without complications. Indeed, in large commercial plants, slaughtering and processing take place within the same building or facility in very short time. Now you know why meat that we purchase in a supermarket has been "aged" by a commercial packing house.

Denaturing Proteins

Denaturation occurs when proteins are exposed to disruptive physical forces such as heat in cooking, or "kneading" a sausage mixture, or by the introduction of chemicals such as alcohol. A common example of a denatured protein is the albumin in an egg as it becomes hard-boiled with the introduction of heat. The gelatinous egg albumin becomes solid.

Proteins are large molecules composed of amino acids, which are arranged in a variety of complex structures. The "primary protein structure" is the simple linear sequence of amino acids within the protein. The "secondary protein structure" is divided into subgroups identified by three shapes. The "alpha helix" looks like a spiral staircase and is a structural protein. The "beta-pleated sheet" looks just like its name implies. The "random coil" does not have a specifically defined shape and this is the one found in collagen although it may link together alpha helices and beta sheets so that proteins may contain all three secondary structures.

Proteins also adopt a tertiary (third in order or formation) structure that is achieved by looping and folding the chain over itself. This folded structure occurs because certain portions of the molecules have an affinity for water. From here, the explanation gets overly scientific for us sausagemakin` wranglers. Suffice it to say, when a protein is denatured, the molecule's tertiary structure is corrupted, and this disruption affects the molecule's secondary (helical) structure without altering its primary structure. In other words, denaturation does not break any of the primary chemical bonds that link one amino acid to another but it changes the way the protein folds in upon itself. Denaturation occurs when proteins are exposed to strong acids or bases, high concentrations of inorganic salts, or organic solvents such as alcohol. In addition, heat or even irradiation can cause denaturation.

Now, here`s the kicker! Whenever the three-dimensional structure of the protein is disrupted, the molecule's biological activity is affected and sometimes the effects may even be detrimental with side effects. Some denatured proteins can result in illness or even death. (Ever hear of "Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy")? However, not all denaturing processes are harmful, and indeed, certain denaturing processes are even beneficial. Remember the "boiled egg"? And what about that sticky meat mass we made with our hands by mixing sausage until the myocin and actin "developed"? It`s pretty much vital to good texture in sausage? Without the development ofactomyocin by the proteins actin and myocin, our sausage would literally fall apart.

In the sausage-making world, we have yet another concern with protein development. Does alcohol denature the proteins in meat? The answer is unquestionably yes. To see for yourself, try making a burger from meat that has had alcohol added to it. It just won`t bind together. On the other hand, does it leave flavor behind? Absolutely! My favorite breakfast sausage is Italian Red Wine Sausage. What a flavor! Yes, somewhere there is a proper balance and there must be prudence and good judgment used.

Soon, we`ll be taking a pork loin and subjecting it to salt, sugar, Cure #1, and a few spices, in order to make Canadian Bacon. It really isn`t bacon at all. It`s ham... or a ham-like product. (Only the rear leg of the piggy is considered "ham".) When increased amounts of salt are added to pork, it impacts proteins and serves as a preservative through dehydration and the osmotic pressure produced inhibits bacterial growth. Salt has always been the primary ingredient used in meat curing and even in low concentrations, it has some preservative action. In the production of ham from pork, critical lipolytic and oxidative changes must occur and the degree and nature of proteolysis in dry-cured ham varies according to climate, temperature, and humidity. Actually it`s not as technical as it sounds and is one of the tastiest pork products you can make. So, shop for a nice pork loin and a box of "kosher" salt at the grocery store and we`ll make those Canadians nervous!

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by rgauthier20420 » Tue Aug 19, 2014 15:10

CW, I forgot to post this picture of the sausage gravy that I'd made with the breakfast sausage. The wife said it's the best she's ever tasted, and I must say I pretty much agree with her. The sausage was tender and amazing. The ingredients were flour, milk, salt, pepper, and cayenne.

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Post by Shuswap » Tue Aug 19, 2014 15:22

CW, thanks for all your background lessons which help greatly to increase our understanding of this tasty hobby as well as why we should pay attention to safe practices.
With all my education and degrees I was a dumb ass when it came to science. It`s only in the last couple of years that I have begun to understand that what I thought was one biological thing called a protein is extremely complex and yet fascinating. My interest was really peaked when I watched Jack Andraka on TED. At 15 years of age he discovered how to identify the protein "misothelan" by a simple paper test that can identify pancreatic, ovarian and lung cancers at their early stage of development with 100% accuracy.

RG that is a great idea. We`ve pondered what to do with our "chunky breakfast sausage" - now we know. :grin:
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